no shade intended, just thoughts and prayers, y’all😇
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Border agents don’t call a prosecutor when they decide to fine someone. A prosecutor gets involved further down the line. Lassie said she is an immigration lawyer and you still refute what she says. Have you never received a speeding ticket? You don’t see a prosecutor until you get to court. Why would anyone want to risk getting fined for taking on an international sitter? That is the question. Or for an international sitter to come and then get turned away at the border?
This may interest some people. However, as an immigration lawyer with almost 30 years experience in immigration law, I trust my own opinion. I am not board-certified, because getting that certification would have required spending months learning areas of immigration law that I never wanted to practice (mainly removal (deportation) and asylum). However, I have far more experience in employment-based immigration than many board-certified lawyers. I know board-certified immigration lawyers that I would not trust with these questions. I worked with one who would refer all his employment immigration questions to me!
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Fining / prosecuting a host isn’t something a border agent is able to do without an investigation. By contrast, they’re legally able to do that with travelers, especially at airports and ports. Foreigners don’t have the same rights as residents, including hosts.
At one point in my news career, I covered U.S. federal and state courts and was required to check daily for newsworthy cases. Many reporters cut their teeth on something similar, making daily calls to authorities. They would for instance flag INS raids to us and we might pursue the bigger cases. Reporters also routinely have to check court dockets for newsworthy cases. Even as journalism students in college, we cut our teeth on such.
Prosecutors (not border agents) decide whom to prosecute among the bosses. Such cases are prevalent in border states where I worked.
If a border agent detains a worker, the case may be transferred to U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), which could further investigate and potentially fine the employer.
Now if someone is fined and pays, it never goes to court. If someone disputes, it goes to court. So if you are a reporter, you will see the cases that go to court. Not all the people that are fined. And ICE fines would be federal and may not be in border states. Someone in IOWA could be holding a festival and has volunteers. Like that CDN who was planing to volunteer at a festival and get free meals. He was stopped at the border. How would you see someone in IOWA or Colorado getting fined by ICE?
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ICE can’t just automatically fine a host, because they’d have to prove that they knew they were hosting someone illegally. There’s no just fining someone without an investigation in such a case.
Yes, ICE (U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement) can fine employers for violations of immigration laws, particularly those related to Form I-9 (Employment Eligibility Verification). These fines can range from civil penalties for minor violations to criminal penalties for more serious offenses, including knowingly hiring unauthorized workers.
How ICE can fine employers:
- Form I-9 Violations:
Employers can be fined for failing to properly complete, retain, and/or make Forms I-9 available for inspection. This includes technical errors (which can be corrected within a timeframe) and substantive errors (which cannot be corrected).
- Knowingly Hiring Unauthorized Workers:
Employers who knowingly hire or continue to employ unauthorized workers can face significant fines.
- Other Violations:
ICE may also impose fines for other immigration-related violations, such as engaging in unfair immigration-related practices or failing to comply with E-Verify requirements.
Types of Penalties:
- Civil Penalties:
These are monetary fines that can range from $281 to $27,894 per violation, depending on the severity and history of non-compliance.
- Criminal Penalties:
For more serious violations, including willful and repeated offenses, criminal penalties may be imposed, including fines, imprisonment, and debarment from government contracts.
- Debarment:
This prevents employers from participating in future federal contracts and receiving certain benefits like federal loans and grants.
Examples of Violations That Can Lead to Fines:
- Failing to obtain or retain Form I-9s for employees.
- Failing to correctly complete Form I-9s.
- Knowingly hiring or continuing to employ unauthorized workers.
- Failing to comply with E-Verify requirements.
- Discrimination based on citizenship or national origin.
There is a reality show about border officers. And they call people, where the incoming person says they are staying, or volunteering. And they are told they could face fines. If an HO was on the receiving end of one of these calls, would they be intimidated enough not to confirm international applicants? That is the point in this whole discussion. Not the likelihood of someone actually getting a fine or being charged. Would the possibility of being sent back or someone getting fined enough to deter. And that is what people are saying. The risk is not worth entering.
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As we’ve seen on countless discussions, everyone has different perspectives and risk tolerances. What folks need to know when it comes to risks is what their odds are. That’s why for instance lawyers don’t tell clients what to do — they lay out context and can estimate the odds of X happening. Then clients decide for themselves, because they’re the ones who’d face the consequences, not the lawyer — and in this case, not you or I.
Everyone’s circumstances are different. Like I posted a story on a separate thread about a guy who quit his job and bought a sailboat and went sailing solo to Hawaii with just his cat. He’s fulfilling a life dream, because time is running out for him, given a serious health issue. Is he taking risks? Of course. But he decided for himself.
We all take risks. We all assess our odds. Why is it necessary for anyone else to decide for us? I bet you’re doing some things that other folks would find risky. Would you want someone else to decide for you instead?
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Isn’t “someone else deciding” precisely the framework on which our legal system depends? We choose representatives, those representatives choose laws, as part of civil society we abide by them even if we don’t particularly like all of them. Our recourse is to choose different representatives and when possible vote for different laws. These aren’t matters of opinion - “You like coffee, I like tea”. People can drink what they want and I would never presume to judge someone else’s choice of beverage.
By contrast, if someone chooses not to abide by the legal framework of their location, that gives me great pause. In my experience, individuals willing to commit crimes, or those willing to assist them to do so, are the types of individuals I would not want in my home. House and pet sitting on a tourist visa in the United States is a crime. Should it be? I personally do not think so. But until the laws are changed, my choice is to engage with sitters and homeowners who are law-abiding. My guess is that those who respect the laws are also those who will respect my property and my pets.
I have traveled extensively throughout the world and in many cases there have been laws with which I disagree. By visiting those countries, I made an informed choice to abide by their laws while in their borders.
I think it is completely fine to say, “Hey, here are the laws of the United States, here are the consequences if you break them.” Period, end of sentence, facts.
I do not think it is fine to say, “Here are the laws of the United States, I can coach you how to break them while lessening the probability of getting caught.” Or, “Here are the laws of the United States, if you get caught it is no big deal”.
Because it is a big deal, in ways many people don’t understand. Let’s use that British backpacker as an example - the one who was detained and deported for housesitting on a tourist visa. Let’s say that five years from now she meets an American citizen overseas, falls in love and marries. Her spouse is offered their dream job back in the States. Well guess what? That backpacker might very well be denied the opportunity to obtain a green card or other type of visa to accompany her spouse, because when you apply for those types of visas they check your entire immigration history and if you’ve committed a crime - which she did, let’s not sugarcoat it - that can be grounds for denial of re-entry. Is it possible she might get an exception? Maybe. But probability applies to groups, not to individuals. The backpacker’s spouse now has to choose between her and the dream job.
I appreciate and respect that your past as a journalist informs your approach to this issue. However, I would ask you to consider whether your days as a reporter too place prior to the current administration. I come from a vibrant, international community with citizens of dozens of countries whose immigration status ranges from dual citizens to permanent residents to student visas and all flavors of work visa. Ten years ago, everyone I know was quite comfortable traveling overseas and returning to their lives in the US. Today, none of them will cross the border. None of them - even the dual citizens. They are missing weddings, graduations, funerals and fun trips. As far as they know, all of them are law-abiding individuals doing the best they can to follow the rules. It breaks my heart to see their lives limited so severely because of the current immigration environment. And this heartbreak informs my strong stance on this issue. “Why is it necessary for anyone else to decide for us?” That is an excellent question. But our legislative and judicial bodies have, in fact, decided for us. And here we are.
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Whether we run risks or not, that’s the someone deciding for themselves.
Worth stepping back and considering that the U.S. was founded by lawbreakers.
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Hi, I have a question it sounds like you have an answer for. Is there an issue coming from Michigan and sitting in Ontario? Do you simply tell them you are visiting friends, or sitting for friends. We have enhanced licenses for crossing. I would love to add Ontario to my areas to sit.
Thanks
It would depend on who you get. If you say you are visiting friends, likely you wouldn’t have a problem. Because of the feelings about the current administration, you might get more questioning. Generally you should be OK.
(edited by Forum team to remove reference to a specific individual)
Thank you. I hope to do some sits in Ontario.
To be accurate, it is not a crime. It is illegal, but a violation of civil laws, not criminal laws. On the contrary, in Texas for one, speeding is a crime. That makes me a criminal but still an excellent housesitter!
Again, not a crime. It could still cause future immigration problems.
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Yikes! I did, indeed, speed in Texas. So I guess I am also a criminal? But still an excellent housesitter!
Thank you for all of your insights here. I had always assumed that breaking the law=crime. If you ever have the time, I would love it if you could post a brief list of questions people can ask when considering a housesit in a country other than their citizenship. Starting with, “Do you have a passport?” (really!) I had a US citizen friend once who was verbally offered a bartending gig in the Bahamas. He was so excited! When I asked him how long it would take to get his visa, he said, “Oh I don’t need a visa! They speak English there!” 
** (He needed a visa. He couldn’t get one. The penalty in the Bahamas at the time, for working without a visa, was deportation, banishment from the country, and a fine of $100,000 US).
Part of the issue is:
- the person running the risk, might not be aware of the risk if they are reading misleading statements by the company of following the “advice” including the letter.
- if the person (sitter) running the risks says they are staying at the homeowners, and didn’t coordinate this in advance with the homeowner, they might be risking consequences for the homeowner. If for instance, the homeowner is living in a country but NOT a citizen of that country, the stakes could be even higher, so it’s not just one person’s risk.
- the homeowner might also be unaware of the risk.
Why would a homeowner who can get a sitter who doesn’t need to take the risk, take the risk? What is in it for the homeowner?
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Gosh almighty. This thread has grown a whole lot since last I looked. And to think that my earlier thread got frozen for curiously asking international housesitters if they intended to adjust plans to visit US. There’s an investment saying of ‘don’t fight the Fed’ [US Federal Reserve Bank] - suspect similar saying could be framed for not seeking to somehow fight US border guards. Losing battle.
I am not a lawyer. Offer no advice whatsoever. Each person has to determine their own risk appetite and assess upside reward. As internationally minded and travel-able people we see the world as a big place.
We were recently contacted by our dream past pet parents in regards a repeat housesit. Wonderful people, super pets and spectacular location. We will decline based on geography. Shame. Our risk appetite prohibits our US travel in forseeable future.
Let’s hope THS uses current opportunity to substantially increase marketing spend to attract pet parents in continental europe, asia, south america and other geographically underrepresented locations. Go THS go!
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I don’t care what individuals’ reasons are — it’s not my business, nor yours or anyone else’s, because they get to decide for themselves. They don’t need our buy-in, approval, etc.
As for being informed, that’s what this thread is aimed at — we’ve covered what you highlighted. And individuals can always go find more info if they think worthwhile.
To me, it’s pointless and presumptuous to tell people what to do. All we can do is share info and perspectives and they’ll always decide for themselves. That’s because they have their own priorities, risk tolerance, etc. And they don’t owe any of us justification or explanation for their choices — it’s their life to live, their decisions to make.
There are people who won’t see this thread or such info, and they’re on their own. But such is life.
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@Lassie, thank you for making informed contributions on this challenging topic.
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Thanks. There are a lot of opinions here, but not all of them are informed! Some people seem unable to resist being didactic, whatever the topic 
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